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TOPIC: Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 3:01 AM
Post 1 of 49
I was just wondering what everyone thought of Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. With Charlie Kaufman films, there always seem to be a wide variety of opinions. I won't go into much detail, as to not spoil anything, but this was probably my favorite of his films that I've seen (the others being Adaptation and Being John Malkovich). I really liked the concepts of Adaptation and BJM, but I just felt like this one had more to say. I'm not great at movie reviews so I'll leave it to Wiyum, Roadie, Peace Frog and the rest of the pros, but I'll just say I really liked it, and highly recommend it.

Also, I just scanned IMDB.com, and noticed that a new Kaufman/Spike Jonze film has been announced. The only notable detail given was that the genre is horror. Could be interesting. Check it out here.

(Edited by Keith at 4:03 am on Mar. 21, 2004)
I TOTALLY AGREE!


Keith, you are destined to rock. Never forget this.
-SLACK

Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 7:50 AM
Post 2 of 49
I'm still dying to see this. Looks like it will be next weekend, though. I've heard only good things, so I can't wait!
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 12:21 PM
Post 3 of 49
It was a good movie. It was very well done. I didn't like it.
I am a horse with no name.
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 1:40 PM
Post 4 of 49
i thought that jim carrey and kate winslet gave performances of their lives, even though i hate jim carrey. their acting was superb. i liked the movie, but i wish that kaufman would make his movies more cryptic and harder to figure out. i think i would like them more if they surprised me.
oh the drudgery of being wet
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 3:03 PM
Post 5 of 49
i really want to see this. plus, jim carrey is in it, which means i have to see it. i don't have to work today..i wonder if i can make an afternoon showing? hmm... and its a nice day outside!...see you guys later...i'm going to the movies!!
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 3:47 PM
Post 6 of 49
"Quote from Keith on Mar. 21, 2004 at 3:01 AM"
Also, I just scanned IMDB.com, and noticed that a new Kaufman/Spike Jonze film has been announced. The only notable detail given was that the genre is horror. Could be interesting. Check it out here.
God, I hope this is "the 3," how great would that be?

Donald Kaufman: I'm putting in a chase sequence. So the killer flees on horseback with the girl, the cop's after them on a motorcycle and it's like a battle between motors and horses, like technology vs. horse.
Charlie Kaufman: And they're still all one person, right?


(Edited by herman at 3:50 pm on Mar. 21, 2004)
Bill, it was a different time. It was back when we didn't know the Russians were incompetent.
Posted  Sunday, March 21, 2004 at 4:26 PM
Post 7 of 49
guess i didn't make it to the movies today. dammit.
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Monday, March 22, 2004 at 3:43 AM
Post 8 of 49
I saw it and was quite impressed... I'm a big fan of Michel Gondry's music vids and was glad to see his style fit so nicely with the story. A great looking film and great story.
Posted  Monday, March 22, 2004 at 9:49 PM
Post 9 of 49
I really, really liked this movie. I definitely enjoyed it more than Being John Malkovich or Adaptation. I found this one easier to watch, as well, so while the other ones are good and definitely interesting, this one has re-play value that the other ones don't have for me. BJM was certainly a creative idea, and while ESOSM didn't seem to have that at first glance of a review (Memento plus other "what if?" romantic comedies/dramas), I really loved seeing how everything played out in the attention to detail. It seems that in all three of these movies there's always that one character who does this one surprising and unexpected act in the end...what they do is not so much surprising as the fact they actually DID it. I don't know, Kirsten Dunst surprised me, as well as Meryl Streep's character in Adaptation..haven't seen BJM in forever so that blows my theory for now.
Why would you do that?
Posted  Tuesday, March 23, 2004 at 11:46 AM
Post 10 of 49
"Quote from Buckley on Mar. 22, 2004 at 9:49 PM"
ESOSM didn't seem to have that at first glance of a review (Memento plus other "what if?" romantic comedies/dramas),
That idea is so played. I think "50 First Dates" nailed it.
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 24, 2004 at 9:22 AM
Post 11 of 49
I love Kaufman & I loved this movie, as I have loved all of his movies. I'm not sure which is my favorite...it may still be "Being John Malkovich", if only for the 7 and 1/2th floor. I thought the cinematography for Eternal Sunshine was very effective, and not overdone like I thought it might be- a lot more sophisticated than BJM. Jim Carrey was excellent. Kate was good, but her character was a bit trite & annoying. I thought the Dr./ Kirsten subplot was an interesting reflection of how the memory erasure was ripe for abuse & generally disrespectful of human emotion. In fact, I like how all Kaufman movies have some theme or character about selfishness and lack of empathy/compassion for other people's lives & feelings. I also like how sometimes these people "win" in the end, like when the faux french girl gets Puff at the end of Human Nature.
Two sips from the cup of human kindness and I'm shitfaced
Posted  Wednesday, March 24, 2004 at 12:38 PM
Post 12 of 49
I saw it yesterday and I thought it was great. THe best part to me is that the only other people in the theater were hoping it would be funny because of Jim Carrie. So, they were waiting to laugh the whole time, and when it was over they were like "that sucked"! I thought that was funny. One guy said something like "I can't wait till it comes out on video and people rent it and bring it back complaining that it was not funny".
Posted  Saturday, March 27, 2004 at 4:43 PM
Post 13 of 49
i think tommorrow will be the day.......its been bugging me all week. i really want to see this......
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Sunday, March 28, 2004 at 9:54 PM
Post 14 of 49
Loved it...but I knew I would.
Posted  Monday, March 29, 2004 at 1:07 PM
Post 15 of 49
The premise for each of the previous two, I felt, has always been good, but both movies had trouble following through and staying consistently good all the way to the end. This movie was the most consistently good of them all.
I can't grow a beard, and I don't like to party.
~Matthew Tiberius Pelham
Posted  Monday, March 29, 2004 at 2:32 PM
Post 16 of 49
still haven't seen it............maybe this week..............
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Monday, March 29, 2004 at 8:03 PM
Post 17 of 49
"Quote from ghostflower on Mar. 29, 2004 at 2:32 PM"
still haven't seen it............maybe this week..............
why dont you just tell us when you see it, instead of when you plan on seeing it and when you dont see it. its getting on my nerves.
oh the drudgery of being wet
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 12:58 AM
Post 18 of 49
mostly because i go through all this trouble just to see it and then something happens that prevents me from it.......

oh by the way...i didn't see it today!
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 8:09 AM
Post 19 of 49
I for one enjoy knowing ghostflower's intentions. Maybe I'll see it with you!

p.s. we can make out in the back if noone's looking.
you're everybody's second home
always trying to get me alone
an easy way to lose it all
always there when all else fails
over by the west side rails
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 10:33 AM
Post 20 of 49
"Quote from ghostflower on Mar. 30, 2004 at 12:58 AM"
mostly because i go through all this trouble just to see it and then something happens that prevents me from it.......

oh by the way...i didn't see it today!
are you maybe going to see it today? or this afternoon? or later tonight? let me know!
oh the drudgery of being wet
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 3:41 PM
Post 21 of 49
i just wanted to say that i saw this movie over spring break. it was wonderful.
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 3:49 PM
Post 22 of 49
"Quote from stopforme on Mar. 30, 2004 at 10:33 AM"
"Quote from ghostflower on Mar. 30, 2004 at 12:58 AM"
mostly because i go through all this trouble just to see it and then something happens that prevents me from it.......

oh by the way...i didn't see it today!
are you maybe going to see it today? or this afternoon? or later tonight? let me know!
I was going to see it tonight, but the friends I invited are already seeing it tomorrow. So, guess what... I'm going tomorrow night! Isn't that hilarious!?!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 3:59 PM
Post 23 of 49
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 30, 2004 at 3:49 PM"
"Quote from stopforme on Mar. 30, 2004 at 10:33 AM"
"Quote from ghostflower on Mar. 30, 2004 at 12:58 AM"
mostly because i go through all this trouble just to see it and then something happens that prevents me from it.......

oh by the way...i didn't see it today!
are you maybe going to see it today? or this afternoon? or later tonight? let me know!
I was going to see it tonight, but the friends I invited are already seeing it tomorrow. So, guess what... I'm going tomorrow night! Isn't that hilarious!?!
I haven't seen it yet. Are you going to Green Hills? Maybe me and Chris can come too! I'll buy you pancakes afterwards if we do!
That's so NA.
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 4:01 PM
Post 24 of 49
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 30, 2004 at 3:49 PM"
"Quote from stopforme on Mar. 30, 2004 at 10:33 AM"
"Quote from ghostflower on Mar. 30, 2004 at 12:58 AM"
mostly because i go through all this trouble just to see it and then something happens that prevents me from it.......

oh by the way...i didn't see it today!
are you maybe going to see it today? or this afternoon? or later tonight? let me know!
I was going to see it tonight, but the friends I invited are already seeing it tomorrow. So, guess what... I'm going tomorrow night! Isn't that hilarious!?!
You're so not funny, Carl.
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 4:50 PM
Post 25 of 49
I watched the first minute of it today. I don't know when I'll get time to see it, but I will definitely PM stopforme daily to keep her updated.
~Digsy S. Slattery

My New York City Exploits
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 5:29 PM
Post 26 of 49
Seriously folks, do yourselves a favor and take all this wasted time at joking about when you'll see this movie and GO SEE THE GOD DAMN MOVIE! It's easily the best film this year, even if the year is only nearly 4 months old.
Posted  Tuesday, March 30, 2004 at 5:33 PM
Post 27 of 49
"Quote from BrianW on Mar. 30, 2004 at 5:29 PM"
Seriously folks, do yourselves a favor and take all this wasted time at joking about when you'll see this movie and GO SEE THE GOD DAMN MOVIE!
Since when did we start talking about The Passion of Christ? Oh wait... I thought you wrote GO SEE THE DAMN GOD MOVIE.
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 11:10 AM
Post 28 of 49
I'm seeing it tonight!! I'm so excited!!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 12:54 PM
Post 29 of 49
i actually saw it twice over spring break... greatness. one of my new favorite movies. since most people haven't seen it, i guess i won't say which parts i really liked... just that the cinamatography was awesome.

i also saw dawn of the dead... which was pretty damn funny...
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 12:56 PM
Post 30 of 49
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 30, 2004 at 6:33 PM"
"Quote from BrianW on Mar. 30, 2004 at 5:29 PM"
Seriously folks, do yourselves a favor and take all this wasted time at joking about when you'll see this movie and GO SEE THE GOD DAMN MOVIE!
Since when did we start talking about The Passion of Christ? Oh wait... I thought you wrote GO SEE THE DAMN GOD MOVIE.
classic
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 1:00 PM
Post 31 of 49
"Quote from ray davies on Mar. 31, 2004 at 12:56 PM"
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 30, 2004 at 6:33 PM"
"Quote from BrianW on Mar. 30, 2004 at 5:29 PM"
Seriously folks, do yourselves a favor and take all this wasted time at joking about when you'll see this movie and GO SEE THE GOD DAMN MOVIE!
Since when did we start talking about The Passion of Christ? Oh wait... I thought you wrote GO SEE THE DAMN GOD MOVIE.
classic
Thank you, thank you.

Did I mention I'm seeing ESOTSM tonight!?!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 5:38 PM
Post 32 of 49
One and a half hours away!!!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 10:13 PM
Post 33 of 49
I liked it even more the 2nd time.
I TOTALLY AGREE!


Keith, you are destined to rock. Never forget this.
-SLACK

Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 11:38 PM
Post 34 of 49
Superb film all around. Go see it!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Wednesday, March 31, 2004 at 11:52 PM
Post 35 of 49
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 31, 2004 at 11:38 PM"
Superb film all around. Go see it!
but when are you going to see it again? maybe this week? maybe this weekend? maybe tomorrow? let me in
oh the drudgery of being wet
Posted  Thursday, April 1, 2004 at 6:29 AM
Post 36 of 49
"Quote from stopforme on Mar. 31, 2004 at 11:52 PM"
"Quote from carligula on Mar. 31, 2004 at 11:38 PM"
Superb film all around.  Go see it!
but when are you going to see it again? maybe this week? maybe this weekend? maybe tomorrow? let me in
I saw it four days ago. I'll probably see it again when it comes out on DVD. I'll keep you posted every few days until then just in case that status changes.
I can't grow a beard, and I don't like to party.
~Matthew Tiberius Pelham
Posted  Thursday, April 1, 2004 at 6:41 PM
Post 37 of 49
Well, I saw it for real last night, and I really enjoyed it. I cried a couple of times, and was surprised how attractive how Jim Carrey was. Beautiful to look at, and a sentimental story without being overly maudlin. Best movie I've seen since "Lost in Translation."
That's so NA.
Posted  Friday, April 2, 2004 at 2:24 AM
Post 38 of 49
well....i finally saw eternal sushine.....

amazing
beautiful
emotional
outstanding

i was in near tears when leaving the theatre.


plus...i got to watch the entire film by myself!!!!!
We have about 1500 songs.....all of them good!
Posted  Friday, April 2, 2004 at 9:57 AM
Post 39 of 49
"Quote from ghostflower on Apr. 2, 2004 at 2:24 AM"
plus...i got to watch the entire film by myself!!!!!
And you know what that means!
I am a horse with no name.
Posted  Friday, April 2, 2004 at 10:13 AM
Post 40 of 49
I haven't seen it again since Sunday, and I still will probably wait for the DVD.

More updates coming soon.
I can't grow a beard, and I don't like to party.
~Matthew Tiberius Pelham
Posted  Friday, April 2, 2004 at 11:10 AM
Post 41 of 49
I've been thinking I should see it again, but I haven't made solid plans yet. I should probably wait until after my penis surgery.
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Friday, April 2, 2004 at 3:54 PM
Post 42 of 49
Still haven't seen it. I may see it on Tuesday.

Is there any way we can post a ticker at the bottom of the board with these updates?
~Digsy S. Slattery

My New York City Exploits
Posted  Saturday, April 3, 2004 at 2:38 AM
Post 43 of 49
"Quote from carligula on Apr. 2, 2004 at 11:10 AM"
I've been thinking I should see it again, but I haven't made solid plans yet. I should probably wait until after my penis surgery.
surgery? from what I saw, the situation looks pretty hopeless. best of luck, though. biggrin.gif
Bill, it was a different time. It was back when we didn't know the Russians were incompetent.
Posted  Saturday, April 3, 2004 at 2:39 AM
Post 44 of 49
i haven't seen this film, but there's a good chance that at some point i'll see it. i'll keep you guys posted. maybe we can have a poll on when i go see it.
Bill, it was a different time. It was back when we didn't know the Russians were incompetent.
Posted  Monday, April 5, 2004 at 11:54 AM
Post 45 of 49
I saw it again last night and I still loved it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Monday, April 5, 2004 at 3:09 PM
Post 46 of 49
Spolier Alert

[From MSN Slate Magazine]

The Science of Eternal Sunshine
You can't erase your boyfriend from your brain, but the movie gets the rest of it right.
By Steven Johnson
Posted Monday, March 22, 2004, at 1:33 PM PT

One of the many rewarding parts of Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind is the fact that the film contains almost no dialogue that sounds like actual neuroscience. The film, as you may already know, tells the story of two star-crossed lovers whose stars have gotten so crossed that they decide to erase their memories of each other, using the services of a company called Lacuna Inc. Lacuna's offices have been cunningly art-directed to look like a low-rent plastic surgeon's, which is precisely the point. Memory erasure, in Eternal Sunshine's world, is just the next logical step up from breast augmentation and Prozac. When Clementine (Kate Winslet's character) first decides to shed her memories of Joel (played by Jim Carrey), she does it "on a lark," the way you might get your forehead Botoxed on a whim. But despite the futurist premise, Sunshine spares us the gratuitous speech explaining How It All Works. There'! s no animated mosquito à la Jurassic Park or some hopeless jargon about "hacking into the neocortex." The closest you get is a nervous conversation between Joel and his doctor: "Is there any risk of brain damage?" The doctor replies, "Technically speaking, the procedure is brain damage. It's on a par with a night of heavy drinking, nothing you'll miss."

For the record, using today's technology, it is not possible to selectively erase an entire person from your memory. But Eternal Sunshine still demonstrates a remarkably nuanced understanding of how the brain forms memories, particularly memories about intense emotional experiences. The film displays a more subtle model of memory formation than the acclaimed thriller Memento, in which a man incapable of forming long-term memories hunts down a killer; he furiously scribbles clues onto Polaroids before his memory fades to black.

Memento revolved around an older model of memory formation, from the days when the brain was imagined as a wetware computer. The fading of memory in Memento is about the loss of pure information, like an erased hard drive. In Eternal Sunshine, the richness of memory is as much about emotion as raw data. There's a wonderful throwaway line at one point in the film, where Joel is reliving a memory of hiding under the kitchen table as a 4-year-old, calling out for his mother. "I really want her to pick me up," the grown-up Joel says, as he relives the experience. "It's amazing how strong this feeling is."

The emphasis on feeling over data processing puts Eternal Sunshine squarely in the mainstream of the brain sciences today. We now know that the brain stores emotional memories very differently from unemotional ones. Negative emotional memories, for instance, tend to capture more details about the experience than positive ones: You remember the general feeling of a nice day at the beach, but you remember every little detail of the two seconds when that Buick crashed into you back in high school. Particularly traumatic memories appear to be captured by two separate parts of the brain: the hippocampus, the normal seat of memory, and the amygdala, one of the brain's emotional centers. People incapable of forming long-term memories thanks to hippocampal damage can nonetheless form subconscious memories of traumatic events if their amygdala is intact. Someone suffering from the Memento condition would likely have a feeling o! f general unease encountering a person or a situation that had caused them harm in the past, though they wouldn't be able to put their finger on what was making them uncomfortable. In Eternal Sunshine, something like this happens. There are several instances in the movie where Clementine appears to have a trace emotional memory of an event that has been wiped from her waking mind.

Eternal Sunshine plays on this idea of traumatic memories being stored in separate regions of the brain in another way, too. In the dazzling, mind-bending sequence at the center of the film, as Joel's memories of Clementine are being steadily eliminated, the unconscious Joel decides that he doesn't want to go through with the erasure after all. Unable to wake himself up, he embarks on a kind of psychic journey with a remembered Clementine, trying to escape the high-tech censor that's steadily stripping away his recollection. As the situation gets increasingly desperate, Clementine suggests burying a memory of her in some place in his brain that she doesn't belong, buried far away from the probing scanner. She suggests a moment of intense humiliation from Joel's youth, and in a flash they're in a memory of a Joel's mother walking in on teenage Joel masturbating.

The fact that Joel is re-experiencing these memories as they're being deleted is consistent with one influential recent theory about how targeted memory erasure might be possible.

For a long time, memory researchers assumed that memories were like volumes stored in a library. When your brain remembered something, it was simply searching through the stacks and then reading aloud from whatever passage it discovered. But some scientists now believe that memories effectively get rewritten every time they're activated, thanks to a process called reconsolidation. To create a synaptic connection between two neurons—the associative link that is at the heart of all neuronal learning—you need protein synthesis. Studies on rats suggest that if you block protein synthesis during the execution of learned behavior—pushing a lever to get food, for instance—the learned behavior disappears. It appears that instead of simply recalling a memory that had been forged days or months ago, the brain is forging it all over again, in a new associative context. In a sense, when we remember something, we create a new memory, one that is sha! ped by the changes that have happened to our brain since the memory last occurred to us.

Theoretically, if you could block protein synthesis in a human brain while triggering a memory, you could make a targeted erasure. The technicians at Lacuna Inc. appear to be doing something along these lines in the film. When Joel first arrives, he's asked to bring in all the objects he associates with Clementine, and he's recorded giving a long description of all his thoughts and feelings about her. While he's exploring these memories of his ex-girlfriend, the techies scan his brain activity with a machine that looks suspiciously like a salon hair dryer but that generates images similar to a real fMRI machine. They refer to this process as making a "map of Clementine." The next day they give Joel some kind of pill that knocks him out and systematically re-triggers all the memories they've recorded. As they're re-triggered, the memories disintegrate while a machine erases them. There's no science babble in the mix, but the basic sequen! ce is broadly compatible with the reconsolidation theory.

Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind is remarkably in sync with modern neuroscience, but in one respect the film put its emphasis in the wrong place. To be fair, it's a failing shared with a host of recent films about memory loss: Memento, 50 First Dates, Paycheck. Selective erasure of memories may not be a feasible procedure in the near future, but cosmetic memory enhancement is likely to be a reality in the next 10 years, just as targeted mood enhancers like Prozac have become commonplace over the past 10. You won't be able to sharpen your memory of a single person, but you may well be able to take a pill that will increase your general faculties of recollection. This is the ultimate irony of Eternal Sunshine and films like it. While the culture frets over the perils of high-tech erasure, we should really be worrying about the opposite: what will happen when we remember too ! much.
Daigle is all we need to make the night complete
Posted  Monday, April 5, 2004 at 4:45 PM
Post 47 of 49
Yesterday made one week since I saw it. The DVD release date has not been announced, so I cannot give my plans for seeing it again yet.

More updates coming soon.
I can't grow a beard, and I don't like to party.
~Matthew Tiberius Pelham
Posted  Thursday, April 8, 2004 at 11:52 PM
Post 48 of 49
I saw the last screening of it at Wynnsong 16 before it is shuffled away to make room for The Girl Next Door. It was really good and thought provoking. Thumbs up.
~Digsy S. Slattery

My New York City Exploits
Posted  Thursday, April 8, 2004 at 11:58 PM
Post 49 of 49
i saw it! what does everyone think about that?