Well, the board is dead today. And I know how much everyone likes reading my posts, so i will post a meaningless thread on theft.

Yesterday I was leaving my physics class at MTSU, and there in front of the KUC was the annual Up Til Dawn fundraiser for those Greek organizations that think they actually make a difference. Anyway, I was walking, quietly, minding my own business, and there runs by me a tall black man with a hoody covering his head, carrying a plastic jar full of money. He had the biggest grin on his face that I've ever seen. And 5 seconds later, a small, white sorority girl running after him screaming, "stop that guy, he stole money!" Well, by the time I realized that she needed help, the 6'5 atheletically trained black male was far away from me. I looked at my Doc Martins and my pale white skin and thought, "dude, I'll never be able to catch him" so i just kept walking towards the KUC. So, basically, this black fella decided he wanted to take the money that was donated for St. Judes children's hospital. This wasnt even the saddest part.

Now, I dont consider myself racist, Some of the things I say, may though, and I apologize, but here was the saddest part of the story.

So I continued on my way to the KUC, and those of us who attend MTSU know that in front of the KUC is anything but integrated. The white emo kids sit under thier tree with the tables and hacky sack circle, and the black ghetto thugs sit under their tree, with thier benches. Well, I passed the latter of the two trees and i saw many many black people cracking up laughing, they thought it was hilarious that this black fella ran away with the cancer kids money. They kept talking about it and laughing. I found this to be more offending than the actual taking of the approximate 50 dollars.

It seems to me, and maybe I overanalyze, but it seems to me, that our culture and our media has made it out to be cool to be a thug. That stealing money from kids with cancer is funny and cool. Being the "baddest Mo'Fo" in the projects of Murfreesboro is the definition of popular. Now I cant generalize all people, black or white, but if this is the case, than I'm offended that this is my generation. I know many people black and white that would never do such a thing. Its just offending to me, how someone like that gets into a higher education institute, especially the one of which I am paying good money to attend.
The end
More Ramblings by
GSTP, MS76, MrSepT

As a graduate of Smyrna High School, I totally sympathize with this. Walking past "That Tree" always takes me back to my senior year where all the thugs would line up in the main hallway and pass/yell judgment at the frightened students. "Hey, nice jacket! Gimme them glasses! Oh I stole yo' hat HAAAAHHHAA!"

I really think this is a case of the immaturity of the few overshadowing the rest. As a graduate of Smyrna High, I can say that MTSU has a much lower ghetto quotient, black and white. But this story really sucks. It's cancer money.

(Edited by DigsySlattery at 3:35 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

Thats Wack.

That's not cool. Stealing money from kids with cancer is worse to the ninth degree than regular stealing.

yeah i suppose its hard to think of things that would make said situation worse...
maybe if the kid was your little sister with cancer and you stole money from her. i suppose that'd be worse.

Maybe you don't consider yourself a racist, but you just gave a story that was predicated entirely on racial stereotypes, complete with the dynamics of a "grinning" athletic black man and a poor victimized small white sorority girl. You even top it off with a nice elitist "what are these thugs doing in my higher education institute" statement.

What is a "thug?" And how do you know this "thug " was "athletically trained?" How do you know the poor small sorority girl doesn't work out? And how does a group of African Americans sitting under a tree make them "ghetto thugs"? The origins of the word "ghetto" actually have nothing to do with African Americans, but I'll spare you the history lecture.

You've managed to beat out Sina in the offensive category my friend, and you were serious.

well said.

Okay... I'm not saying that it's funny for someone to steal money from kids with cancer...

But, you have to admit, the fact that anyone is desperate enough to do that could be at least slightly humorous. Especially if the guy was SO proud of himself for it...

Here's another reason why this might be funny..

Forget that it's cancer money for a moment. Picture snotty, white sorority girls having a fundraiser to buy their matching t-shirts or something and some big black man runs along and snatches their money jar. The looks on the girls faces would probably be something to laugh at, not to mention watching one of them (presumably the head sorority snot) chasing after him... She will be praised and admired for her courageous act by all of her followers unpon her return.

Ha.. what, exactly, was she planning on doing if she caught him?

***I based all of my comments on GSTP's account.. and also on my best friend's (who happens to be black) that also witnessed this event. For the record, she saw the humor in it, based on reactions of people around... not because the theif was a super-cool thug.

(Edited by weenysmack at 4:14 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

Hmmm, well sorry you feel that way. It's easy to stereotype. But the story is true, reguardless of my colorful language, it was more for storytelling purposes. And I'm not exactly sure what a "thug" is, But I think if you act like an idiot, that may pertain to being a thug. Also, I didnt say "these thugs" I meant the one idiot that took the money. Why is he at an institute of higher education when he's obviously an idiot. Unless of course he really needs the money for his babies momma. And the black male was atheletic, 6'5, and had a large grin. He ran very fast. These are all true accounts of the story.

(Edited by GrungeSlobTearPants at 4:18 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

how exactly do you fit into a higher education institute?
you better edit that one.

oh and you did say "the black ghetto thugs sit under their tree." although grammatically correct, its still a negative generalization.

I also feel that "white emo kids" is a negative connotation.

Aw, you're just sensitive because you're Asian.

I am very liberal and yet still think some of us are being overly PC. Nate-Dogg's story probably could have done with out some of the adjectives, but I don't believe he was trying to stereotype.

Dig yourself deeper please.

Since you take so much pride in your higher education, perhaps you ought to consider taking an African American history course, and learn exactly how it was that African Americans ended up in higher education. Or even a basic composition course, where clarity and precision are taught as important writing skills. Maybe you'll be more careful when throwing around meaningless and offensive words like "thug."

Dude, you were turning away shots like Tomas Vokoun there until you opened up the five hole for this one to get stuffed into. You might as well give it up... I must congratulate you on your enormous balls to even post this subject, because you had to know you were going to get crucified for whatever you said.

While you're being kicked while down, it's baby's momma or if he was the father of multiple babies, it would be babies' momma.

And we all know that all black guys are athletically trained becuase they were bred for that back in the day. Just ask Jimmy the Greek. Duh. Was there fried chicken and watermelon seeds stuck in his wide grin?

WHA HAPPENED!

again, i apologize for offending you.


The story is true. I am and have never been an expert on african american culture. and never claim to be. Im sorry a word such as "thug" offends anyone. I personally just wanted to share a true story.

I hope everyone read that and was very offended by this person's actions.

Offended? No. Actually, I thought it was funny that the honky was too much of a pussy to chase down the big black fella. Crazy crackers!

(Edited by carligula at 4:37 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

Well said.

Thanx Chris,

PeaceFrog, I was fully aware of this. I guess it adds to the excitement of my posting. What outrageous response will I get from my all-loving features friends. Its part of my cynical nature to speak my mind on controversial subjects, and use colorful language from time to time. Those who dont want to hear it, dont have to read it. Simple enough.

Wow, you're an ignorant son of a bitch. I can't help but wonder if said black man's teeth were staggeringly white next to his "heart of darkness" black skin. Did he shout "mammie, I sure am got me some goods fo momma now, yes'ram!" I'm surprised he didn't try and rape that poor, defenseless white girl, hypersexualized as I'm sure he is. Why don't you lynch him in the town square tomorrow. You'd probably have quite an audience. Your language is colorful in more than one sense friend. Maybe you should get those monkeys from under the tree and back into the tree where you seem to think they belong. They've been running from those hounds for too long.

obviously, there has been a break-down in communication here..

I can vouch for GSTP... he's hardly a racist... in fact, I don't know of many people as accepting of people as he is..

with that said, he also isn't scared of calling things how he sees them... if somebody steals things, I don't think they deserve to be referred to in the nicest of terms.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and sounds like a duck.... it's probably a duck.

Chill out, yo.

(Edited by weenysmack at 4:49 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

Ha,

again,
story was true. Read it in sidelines or mtsusidelines.com when the story comes out tomorrow or monday.

GSTP,

I really am trying to be constructive here, and I couldn't disagree more with your statement that people who don't wish to hear your opinions don't have to read them. It's important to read them and discuss them because these are dangerous times to be misinformed. The story may be true but it still doesn't need to have such a stereotyped spin. When a crime occurs on my school campus, if the only description the victim provides is "black male," then the paper doesn't print it. It means nothing. It is just a stereotyped image, an embodiment of fear that only creates more problems and racial stereotyping.

I dislike theft as much as anyone else, but it's important to be precise and careful what you say. You may think "athletically trained black man" was a precise description but it wasn't.

And I will read the story when it comes out, because I'm just as curious to know how your school paper addresses it.

Let's hope cops don't take eyewitness accounts of "pale white emo kids" as accurate when busting under-agers at 12th and Porter.

This is ludacris.

No, this...




... is Ludacris. You would know that if you weren't such a whiteboy.

now if that isnt straight thuggin', then i dont know what is.

Wow,
well I guess when I wrote this thread I wasnt expecting it to be chopped up and handed back up my ass the way it has been. The fact of the matter is, I'm not racist. Believe it or not. I could sit here and tell you all about my experiences in life. Believe it or not, ive spent time in Haiti, doing missions work there for a predominantly black 3rd world country. You could take that statement and say, thats just him trying to make us believe...blah blah...well the fact is, i dont care what alot of you believe. I could tell you about my black friends, that would just sound even more racist. The fact is, the smiling connotation, that was the reality, i didnt even think it to be even remotely racist, maybe you are the racist for interpreting it that way. The whole thug negative connotation, im gonna stick with that. The fact is, you will get a negative connotation from me if you act like a fucking idiot. And stealing money from a cause to help kids with cancer, thats being a fucking idiot. As far as the groups, thugs, yes another negative connotation, if you sit around and laugh about such a serious issue, again, you will receive a negative connotation.

The fact is, we wouldnt be dicussing this had the story been told (same wording) by anyone but me. (you could say, well other people wouldnt write it like that, they arent as big of a bastard as you) Whatever, Thats fine. It just makes some of you look like idiots. I cant wait until (if) people from london join this forum. You guys will have a field trip because someone holds a different view, trying to alienate and rid yourselves of those different. Some of you are very closed off. You cant read very many forum threads on here without seeing the word sucks. "something sucks" whether it be a musiciain, a person, a film, a song. Everything sucks to some of you, I get the feeling that some of you are still going through your teen angst.

Regardless, I find this board more humurous than anything. If you want to chop up my story, thats fine. Read it how you will. But in the end, truth prevails in a free marketplace of ideas. And the truth, Who on here really is the closed minded fool? Me or you?

Yes, I will continue to post what I think. Dont read it next time, and you wont be offended.

That sure was fabolous...

(Edited by DigsySlattery at 5:54 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

Ditto and ditto

Thank you for saying that. Silly Jimmy the Greek.

Nice try, cracker.

i cant help but feel obligated to stand up for other minorities. i wish it were easier to feel pity for retards like gstp, but maybe thats just my teen angst talking.

(Edited by stopforme at 10:32 pm on Oct. 30, 2003)

I'm offended by your use of the term "retards". Arent they a minority group, those with down syndrome. And there you are comparing them to me, making such a negative connotation about a minority group. You should be ashamed, you bastard.

fag

you're cool

i don't think that's true at all... it has nothing to do with who you are, but what you said. the people who have called you out for your comments are not people who are known for being quick to judge based on whether or not they like a person, or even know them. i think most of them were just trying to tell you that the way you come off by highlighting people's races as a part of the story is that you think race was the main factor in what happened. whether or not you meant it that way, it came off that way. i don't think it makes them look like idiots by calling you out for that.
you say that when london kids join the board, it's going to cause people on this board to alienate themselves and get rid of new people on the board... where does that come from? how is calling someone out for making racist comments trying to 'rid yourselves of those different'? and how does that make those people 'closed off'. your arguments and defenses for what you said make no sense. i understand you weren't trying to come off like you did, but you did. i would think new people joining the board would be more turned off by your original post, because of how ignorant it sounds, than by anything said in response to it.

has anyone ever had a field trip? sounds interesting....

(Edited by featuresgirl at 1:58 am on Oct. 31, 2003)

i hope someone catches that son of bitch!!! he's not just stealing from St. Jude, he's stealing from me....i was (still am) a patient at St. Jude Hospital. thats not cool.

1) i agree. even though it could have been better worded, some of you are blowing it out of proportion.

2) ceeze once turned down an interracial three way. now who's the bigot?

3) since when is mtsu an institute of higher learning? maybe we're not at the same school. i might be able to compromise and give you
institute or even of learning, but the higher bit would be a stretch.

(Edited by damon at 2:13 am on Oct. 31, 2003)

mtsu sucks, fuck mtsu

you know the retarded kids who do janitorial work in high school? yeah, they're easily capable of meeting our requirements here, which i'm pretty sure consist of a 12 on the ACT and $50 cash money.

Truth be told, we could all nitpick at what each other says on the board. Hell, Carl and I do that to each other all of the time. But, it's just kidding around. I knew where GSTP was coming from and I knew it wasn't racially slighted, and to be honest, I didn't even think of it like that until somebody else pointed it out. However, I must admit that the only reason I'm interjecting into this conversation is because I am staunchly opposed to the environment becoming too politically correct around here. I think, in all honesty, that we all do a pretty good job of trying not to step on too many toes here on the messageboard. If somebody is going out of their way to push buttons, then it is obvious. This was not an act by him to offend. He just wanted to relay a story, and blah blah blah ensued. Lay off. Some of you probably wouldn't know racist if it bit you on the ass, but I should hold off on the generalizations. Anyway, give him a break. It would just be nice. If he's being dumb, then just leave him be and let him stick out like a sore thumb. I know I'm contradicting myself by saying that, but I really feel the need to side with him because this is all quite ridiculous. Don't make people think things that they didn't already, like in my case.

GSTP has gotten the shaft like a bitch. It's quite unfair.

(Edited by richarddawson at 4:14 am on Oct. 31, 2003)

I wouldn't let the minorities on this board, (the uptight liberals), affect me one bit. A lot of people pick out what they want to hear and then leave the rest, take things out of contezt and all that. Some of these people are actually trying to help you out and trying to not hurt peoples' feelings. Some are just trying to feel better about themselves by pointing out any flaws that they find or can conjure up. If you talk to most level-headed black people, you'll find that they're not easily offended and that they're consistent. By consistent, I mean, that if they can say 'thug' then you can say 'thug'. It's the black people who have alterior motives or that don't think for themselves who are looking for a fight about racism. Same with whites.

A lot of the white leadership in America and even some black leaders who want to keep power, instead of building people up and helping them rise above it all (something MLK was good at doing), are making sure that people stay victims and keep feeling like they're below it all. That way of thinking trickles down Racism is still a factor in America. Sadly, it always will be. GrungeSlob's remarks were not racist.

i agree with mr. dawson. political corectness goes too far a lot of times - this being an example. get over it.

(Edited by damon at 4:35 am on Oct. 31, 2003)

I agree, and I consider myself an uptight liberal.

The fact of the matter is that this issue isn't really white vs. black at its heart. Sure, that's a description of the parties involved, but really, it's an issue of thug vs. clean/normal/whatever. There are plenty of thuggish whites who would do the same thing, and plenty of normal blacks who would raise money for charity, but I think that GSTP was just reporting observations he made, which included the colour of peoples skin because 1)it was overwhelmingly segregated between the two groups and 2)its hard to ignore the fact that someone has a certain colour skin, much like its hard to ignore the fact that someone has a certain colour shirt.

I wrote out two VERY long responses to this but I lost them both to computer crashes. They were both much longer than anything i've ever put on this board. Needless to say I am so pissed off right now I am not going to type anything more. I addressed all the issues and angles, made my arguments and anticipated the arguments of others. Basically, to sum up, I was siding with etcetera, although not completely. My biggest problem was with the "black ghetto thug" comment.

But I also have a problem with foldsfan's assertion that "its the black people with alterior motives or who don't think for themselves who are looking for a fight about racism." So, for example, a black man who can't get picked up by a cab, or gets treated unfairly in a restaurant (because the restaurant doesn't want it to turn into a "black restaurant"), and goes out and files a complaint and tries to organize a boycott, he has an alterior motive or can't think for himself?? What a (pardon the harshness) stupid comment! I mean, did Dr. King have alterior motives too? Please explain, but know that I'm going to hold you to that.

Again, this is only about 1/20th of what I originally had to say.

I don't think I was calling anyone racist, I was saying the story had an unnecessary racial spin. A black guy may have stolen money from a white sorority girl, but that doesn't mean all the "athletically trained" "fella" "thug" descriptives were necessary. I think if it had been a white guy who stole money from a white girl, no descriptives at all would have been added to the story.

And the accusations of being overly-PC and an "uptight liberal" are just dismissive and easy ways to divert from an important issue that is hard to discuss. GSTP's remarks were offensive, unnecessary, and inaccurate.

And foldsfan, I'm also really curious about this whole "people who fight racism can't think for themselves comment." I think that may be the most offensive thing posted to date on the message board, but I don't want to say anything until you can clarify.

Once again, I think it's apparent who is choosing to hear certain things by the comments about my statement. I hate to quote myself, but since you picked it apart, I suppose I will, too. SO let me clarify or repeat what I said. Maybe you'll read it with a clearer mind this time. First, I didn't name names and even tried to explain that I knew everyone wasn't an "uptight liberal". Some people are caring, compassionate people who try to stand up for other people.

Well, I could very easily be wrong, but I think foldsfan was writing under the assumption that we no longer live in that era. Personally, I am lucky to have had the experiences in this area that I have, because I have never been witness to an african american being treated unjustly based on his race. Unfortunately, as a result of this, I am not easily persuaded to think that there is much racial prejudice against blacks, outside of a few small-minded people, who are outweighed heavily by the majority of people. In my opinion, Mexicans, Indians (people from India), and Arabics are far more likely to face the brunt of our current racial climate. Blacks are accepted just as much as I was as a white person, where I come from. The argument could be made that we had no racial prejudice aganist each other (blacks or whites), because we were very diverse in my hometown. It just wasn't an issue. Anyway, here's my point. Never ever ever have I known of a black person to get kicked out of a restaurant, because he was black, or anything along those lines in any situation. No person, white or otherwise is ignorant enough to do something like that in the time we live in. Yes, I'm being very optimistic and possibly too naive, but if this happens, please tell me. On the other hand, this really scuzzy looking person might walk into a place and he might just happen to be black, hell he could even be white. He could be asked to leave and while I would never do it, I think the place has every right to do what they think is in their best interest and in the best interest of their customers, whether the person be black, white, yellow, etc. Does it deserve to be turned into a racial matter? Hell no, that's just as racist of someone to assume that because this other person is kicking them out, that they are racist. It's a two-way street. Most of this probably makes no sense, and while I do think that foldsfan's comment could have been worded better, I do see where he is coming from.

For the record, I wasn't allowed to eat a restaurant on 2nd Avenue once, though I had eaten there plenty of times and always left a good tip. Why? It was a different waitress and she "wasn't going to wait on kids who wouldn't tip." Her words. My friends and I were asked to leave. Did I call Jesse Jackson, the Rainbow Coalition, David Duke, or Al Sharpton? Nope, I walked out with no fuss and I haven't been back since. The best retribution I can give to them is by not giving them my business, because they were ignorant enough to make assumptions about me just because I was young. In your restaurant example roadie, the best solution is to turn the other cheek, but that's just my personal belief. Too many things are blown out of proportion because of race. Why? Because, as a country, we are a bunch of whiny sissys. Why do you think we have so many lawsuits every year? We're spoiled bitches as a population and our ego is huge. Why else would we turn a small matter into a media frenzy, which is what would happen in reality if your restaurant example took place. Fuck us. America needs to get over itself and stop making baby shit issues into "outrageous acts." I hate that about us, and the country is guilty as hell of it, but only because we grow up with it everywhere. We can't help it. Enough about that.

(Edited by richarddawson at 12:10 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

because you were there, witnessing this event, I'll have to agree with you. I was just trying to bring everyone down.

The fact is, a word is a word. Sticks and stones. While writing my little description of an action, you're right, my wording was probably not exactly politically correct, and if i could go back a day ago and think about exactly how to please everyone, maybe I would've chosen different words. But the descriptions were accurate according to my eyes, a white, middle class american. Now, again, I dont feel as though I'm racist, maybe you do because you know me soooo well. But the fact is, there will always be racial stereotyping as long as we have races. The word Thug, its a word, 2pac used it, many times in negative ways, but he also glamourized it to be a thug. Many people, black and white and blue use it on a daily basis to place someone in a category. What is the exact definition? I guess thats all subjective, it can be changed according to the situation. Lets think of another word, Redneck. Used to describe white country boys who are looking for a fight. It has a negative connotation when used in the right context also. But if I were to have described, a group of boys sitting on the steps, "rednecks" I'm sure no one would cause a fuss. I think that white people are more afraid of racial descriptors, than black people. Hell the N word has been normalized within the black culture. Now, used in the right context, in the right manner, by the right person, it is offensive.

But to sit here and tell me, what my motives were behind making an "accurate" description through my eyes, thats silly. Tell me I'm a racist, tell me I'm offensive, thats fine, but I dont believe you, and neither do those that know me.

I think that what's so frightening about all of this is that GSTP didn't "mean to offend" or that others didn't notice his racist comments until they were pointed out. I am an uptight, bleeding heart liberal and I will fly that flag until the day they put me in the ground. I don't think anyone was disputing the fact that a black man stole a white girl's fundraising money. It obviously happened. There were lots of witnesses. I'm also not defending the guy. But that doesn't give someone clear reign to turn him into a caricature of thuggish blackness. Just because some Arabs bombed planes doesn't give us the right to call them towel-heads for the forseeable future (though many obviously do). The fact is, racism is not really a black or white (no pun intended) issue. You don't have to lynch people or burn crosses in their yards to be racist. It can manifest itself in more subtle ways. This brings me back to my original point. The fact that GSTP and his associates couldn't perceive these racist comments until they were pointed out by others is the truly disturbing thing. I don't think it matters if you went to Haiti or have black friends. I know people who have black friends and that doesn't stop them from saying things like "coon." Your comments were out of line. You're probably not a racist and I'm sure you're a nice guy and all. I'm just really sensitive to this issue because I grew up in the deep south (Alabama) and a lot of people in my family are racist and it really upsets me. I just think these are things worth discussing. I don't want to try and shut anyone down and my first post was a bit over the top so I'm trying to be more constructive.

even though i dont want to, im going to disagree with richard dawson on a certain point. this "too pc" business really rubs me the wrong way, and it came up with carl a while ago too. i would really like an explanation as to why being pc in any volume would be considered negative. for example, i think that peta is over the top sometimes, but i would never call them too pc or find them at fault for their active opinions. i think that the more people are realize other peoples reactions to what they say/do, the more conscientious they can be -to everyone- in the future. whether that changes their minds or not doesnt matter, but at least they might realize that they could piss someone off if they do it in the future. if one of us felt offended by what gstp said and didnt respond because we were afraid of being too pc, its like he would have been given permission to be racially offensive. i would hate to think of myself as someone who allowed him that permission.

Neuboy, not all of these comments are directed at you, but some are

So, is it your opinion that such a person does not exist...? What if he did look like that? I wasn't there, but I've seen such people before. I've seen lots of them. I don't think he was doing anything more than giving an apt description, which is apparantly wrong, as far as I can tell by many of your comments. I had somebody steal some cigarettes from work the other day. I called the police as the store's owner has instructed me and they came to get a description. First question when they wanted the description...male or female. Second question...race. And, so on. Does that mean it's racist to tell them that he was white? NO! It's a goddamn clarifier, for christ's sake. They wanted to catch him! It narrows the possibilities! GSTP was just inherently trying to describe this person as best he could. It's not fair to say that he wouldn't have described the person as white if he were. Did you know that white thugs exist too? Hold the presses! White thugs?! You're kidding, cmon be serious rd. Don't yank my chain. I ain't playin. Is it more racist to assume that because he said thugs, some of YOU automatically thought that he only said that because they were black?


I hate it when people cry racist. It truly pisses me off more than anything. Neuboy, I assume part of this is directed at me, so for your sake, please meet me before you decide that I am inherently racist and I don't know it. Please. Race is not an issue with me. There's no way for me to prove that to you, other than to say that I think you are reading more into what he said than was there and I wasn't. I didn't read too much into it, because I knew what he meant. I knew he wasn't adding that in so people would hate the wicked black man. Some of us are more forgiving in our analyzations of others writings.

(Edited by richarddawson at 12:36 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

Yeah racism doesn't exist anymore. There's no such thing as landlords who don't rent to African Americans, no such thing as cops who beat the hell out of African Americans, no such thing as job ceilings, racist epithets, a profound lack of African Americans in the federal government, an overrepresentation of African Americans in prison (and that's not because they're more likely to be "idiot" "thugs"), and no such thing as gerrymandering of voting districts to defuse African Americans' potential as a voting bloc. Since you're so interested in the role of black leaders, contact an official from the NAACP who has lobbied before the Bush administration and ask them if they think "racism" ended with the Civil Rights Movement. I could go on.

But slavery is over, segregation is over, they got their damn right to vote. God bless the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments and the Voting Rights Act of 1964. It's all over. Now let's forget those hulking, athletic black thugs and go get them "Arabics."

Sorry that was from me, not neuboy.

Easy, tiger. I'm not going to respond to that, except by saying that certain things are out of sight and out of mind. I thought I made that clear. Guess not. And fuck off for your last paragraph. That might be the rudest thing anyone has ever suggested of me and I am terribly offended. You meant it.

(Edited by richarddawson at 12:33 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

Come on, I know your reading comprehension is better than this. "It's the black people with alterior motives or who don't think for themselves who are looking for a fight about racism." That's exactly what I said. You even typed it out for yourself. Those are the people who are LOOKING for a FIGHT about RACISM. Not who are being VICTIMS of RACISM. that's all I was saying. I even later went on to say that racism is still a problem. Obvious grounds for fighting racism.

Consistency. That's what I look for. Grunge's remarks weren't racist. He consistently noted the color of everyone's skin.

Yes, those comments are stupid at the end of your quote. I know you're not stupid, but you're the one who typed up that inane scenario.

(Edited by foldsfan at 12:35 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

heres the difference between your situation with the police and gstps situation. he used the "descriptive" words "black" or "white" 9 times in the post.

so, lets consider that after the cop asked you for the description of the shoplifter, he then asked you what happened and you responded with something like this: well, this big black man came into the gas station. he was looking for some cigarettes. then the black mans friends came in. they were a group of black thugs. i assume that they are all friends. since im just a white guy, they obviously had more power than me and i felt too afraid to confront them when i saw the black man put the pack of gum in his pocket; plus, he was a really big black man. if i werent such a white pussy, i would have done something about the situation, but i just let them go and called you [the cops].

do you see the difference? the guy in gstps story was obviously black, we are not disputing that. however, this "apt description" WAS offensive and no one has to "read into it" to recognize that.

Being conscientous is one thing and it's what we should all do. I said that, the "stepping on toes" part. But, analyzing every word of what somebody says and suggesting that they are racist because of it, even though they obviously are not, all in the name of PC? That's why. And if GSTP offended anybody, it's me. I am white, how dare he generalize the sorority girl as white. That bastard.

He was consistent and all of you have managed to blow it out of proportion because you like to think you're helping some minorities cause. In reality, you're just being too senstitive. Does anybody have Ted Nugent's phone number, I need some backups.

You may be right about the first paragraph there.

ANd people who fight racism are independent, clear thinking, and correct people. Grunge said nothing racist. Were you really offended by his comments? Your race was offended by this? You think black or white people reading that as a whole would be offended by those comments?

I think anyone who does is not fighting a form of racism, but looking for a fight. That's what I meant. I think it just comes from me not thinking using the word thug (a word that is not derrogatory, but is a way of life for a some, i.e. "thug life") or describing someone's skin color ("I'm Black and Proud") is racist. You do. That's all. YOu're obviously more sensitive than I am. Which can be a good thing. Sometimes.

If they were bigger than me, I would be afraid too. It's human nature, baby. Anyway, I see your point stopforme and I love you. I just don't think GSTP's story was as animated as your analogy. It was entertaining though.

A lot of you are just begging to go on a trip to Westmoreland with me. You just don't know racism, except for Neuboy. He may be the exception, but only because I can believe that Alabama would have lots of racism, since I know some people in the southern part. Uh-oh, that wasnt pc of me, was it? I generalized. Damn.

So, I feel like I instigate arguments around here. But here it goes again. We white middle class features fans are sitting here arguing about the political correctness of descriptors. Here is a post (I hope she doesnt mind) from a member on our board almost a year ago, on another controversial thread I started about a "features look".........discrimination among features fans. But wait, we dont discriminate....or do we?

Thank you. That's what I've been trying to get at, particularly the sensitivity part.

Shouldn't someone be up in arms about the use of the words "fag" and "retards" in this topic?

Honestly

they were used in jest, ceeze. the distinction between what i said and what he said is that he was being completely serious. i would never call a homosexual a "fag" nor would i call a person with any disability a "retard." please, take a hint, bitch.

RD,

I'm sorry to have offended you and I am not trying to suggest you are some unbridled bigot or something. I don't know you. All I know is what you posted, which seemed to me to suggest that racism isn't relevant unless it's inscribed in law or is something you encounter everyday. And the last comment was just pointing out that you used the name of a language to group together a bunch of people that span many countries and a lot of geographical space. But please let me know if I interpreted your comments incorrectly. And you're right, I don't know your background and you don't know mine. That's all. I'm not trying to start a fight, this is just one of those issues that I get really worked up. I also concentrate in school on African American history so I am probably coming at this from a different perspective and I may be too sensitive. But I don't want to have offended you more than anyone ever has.

This is turning into a shit storm that half of me is scared of and the other half is well...I don't know what.

First let's all take a deep breath. We are all fans of this band, we all have many mutual friends, and I don't think anyone is accusing anyone else of being an actual bigot. We are all looking for the same thing which is a society where people are not discriminated against because of cultural, racial, gender, etc. differences.

I'm going to cut right to the chase. RD, to answer your question, yes you are too optimistic and naive. There is a very big serious motherfucking problem in New York City with cab drivers refusing pick up african-americans trying to hail cabs. The actor Danny Glover has brought this issue to nationwide attention. there is also a very serious motherfucking problem in Nashville Tennessee with certain restaruants making african-americans feel unwelcome because there is a stigma in this town surrounding the outcomes of welcoming an african-american clientele. Example: Atlantis, the seafood restaurant with the country club atmosphere. About a year ago they started having jazz combos for entertainment. Some african-american jazz enthusiasts began frequenting the restaurant. The owners became worried about the repercussions of an influx of an african american clientele. They stopped the jazz music and began giving african americans cold service. This is only one example of a nationwide trend. FYI, this problem was well documented in a Nashville Scene cover story a couple months back. You better believe this shit exists.

But these are two very minor issues regarding contemporary racial discrimination. I picked them out of thousands others for no other reason than I thought they were WELL KNOWN BY EVERYONE, and wouldn't really be argued. Apparently not, and all I can say is wow.

foldsfan, fair enough, but with a loaded comment like that its a good idea to clarify exactly what you mean. There are a lot of people out there who believe in exactly that comment. That's why I asked for an explanation.

Lastly, you guys have yet to respond to neuboy's assertion that the proof of the existence of racial stereotypes is in the fact that GSTP didn't consider his comments insensitive until someone pointed it out, or offer a real response to etcetera's list of many other instances of widespread discrimination that you guys deem to be (sadly)....out of sight and out of mind??!!

Peace

Do you really think that I would call an African American Male a "thug" to his face unless i was just joking with him? Get real..... You may want to make me look like that much of a bigot, but im not. You used your descriptors to describe me, someone who you disapprove of, I used mine to describe people whose actions I disapproved of.

(Edited by GrungeSlobTearPants at 1:37 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

Apology accepted.

And sorry, I should have said Middle Eastern. But, hopefully, you got the point of my message and not my lack of good terminology. The lesson of this whole thread!

no, but the point is i wouldnt even call a homosexual a fag to his face or to ANYONE. thats the goddamn difference

But you'll use it in a degrading fashion towards me? Is that the goddamn difference? Fag is probably more offensive in a degrading fashion than thug.

yes, i will use it in a degrading fashion towards you. and i cannot see how it is more degrading than thug, but ill call you a thug too if thats what you want.

Can't we all just get along?!?!?! (sob)

I know you were joking. That's not the issue. I was commenting on the hypocrisy that is quite evident here. You don't think your flippant use of derogatory terms could potentially be offensive to someone? I would venture to say there are homosexuals that view this board, and some of us have family member that would be considered "retarded". Why aren't you being taken to task by the masses for something you did not mean to be offensive, but turned out to be?

Basically to me, you have no valid argument. You cant see that "thug" is actually as said before a way of life in american culture. It can be used and misconstrued yes.

Fag, that is nothing but degrading. A homosexual would never ever ever want someone to call them a fag. It is a very harmful and hurtful word, and to use it to degrade anyone is just adding to the problem.

Your posts on this subject have mostly been useless as far as I can tell and your whole point is to try and make me look worse than I already do. To me, thats silly.

exactly! calling a homosexual a fag would be very degrading to them just as calling an african american a thug would be degrading! im glad we are on the same page there! however, i have not called a homosexual a fag. i called you a fag. if you are a homosexual or if you are a person with a mental disability, i am deeply sorry and very embarassed. if not, then my insult stands. i can call you whatever i want but i wouldnt call you a cracker. what about this dont you understand? actually, i really dont have time to explain this any further.

We're not all as well-read as you road-dogg, sorry. Don't ever say wow in response to my ignorance ever again? Comprende?

As for out of sight and out of mind, I don't typically get involved and/or wrapped up in shit that doesn't affect me or people I am close to. Why? People can fight their own fights. Which is funny, because you all are acting like it's a sin, but most of you are the same people against getting involved in the Middle East. That's weird. This isn't a "fight" that needs anything more than my actions. And by actions, I mean that I will continue to see people and not races. That is the best way for me to get involved at this point, to lead by example.

booya

But wait, lets see here, so its ok to use a word if you are just joking, like calling someone whom you know, (me) but actually dont know, a fag, b/c you know that I'm not a fag, your using the word to make a point........


So what if my point of using the word thug, was to make a point. That anyone who would steal money from a cause to cure cancer, is being a "thug". Regardless of whether he fits the thuggish criteria or not. And those who laugh and think its funny also are being a thug.........the words used to make a point, to degrade the actions of those who acted. Not to degrade an entire culture. ......using colorful language to make a point.....


But wait, I was reminded very quickly that I'm in fact the asshole, not the man who stole the money, and the people who laughed instead of stopping the incident.

This is the best fight ever!

Merriam Webster

Main Entry: thug
Pronunciation: 'th&g
Function: noun
Etymology: Hindi thag, literally, thief
Date: 1810
: a brutal ruffian or assassin : GANGSTER, KILLER

Do you have any gay friends? Because that is very false. I've known several homosexuals who freely use the term "fag" or "queer" to refer to themselves and their gay friends. I suppose it's akin to a black person calling himself and his friends "niggers". It's all about context.

Stopforme, because you brought it up, I believe there's definitely such a thing as too much of a good thing. Having faith in a higher power has the potential to make someone a better, more positive person, but being overzealous can make someone very annoying and downright dangerous to themselves and other people around them. Too much oxygen can kill brain and lung tissue. Too much confidence in oneself becomes arrogance. Too much chocolate makes you fat (no offense to the overweight people (myself included) out there). Too much water in the body can flush out essential nutrients. Being politically correct is great to a certain extent, but too much of it can obscure the real issues at hand. (By the way, I'm not claiming that to be the case in this thread-- I think this whole thing can be very interesting if we decide to respect one anonther's opinions.) Everything in moderation-- except the Features!

Main Entry: fag·got
Pronunciation: 'fa-g&t
Function: noun
Etymology: origin unknown
Date: 1914
usually disparaging : a male homosexual

Merriam Webster says that the term is "usually disparaging" meaning, "to lower in rank or reputation" ....hence usually used in a derrogatory fashion if we want to get technical about. Of course there are exceptions. And a gay man wanting to refer to himself as a fag is different than SFM using it to degrade another being.

I guess the same thing can be said about Thug, although, it is not necessarily "disparaging". A thug as merriam webster states, is a thief. A man stealing money , is in fact a thief. Again.

(Edited by GrungeSlobTearPants at 2:11 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

RD--

You don't get wrapped up in stuff that doesn't concern you or people you know. Let them fight their own fight. Like money being stolen from cancer patients, for instance. Let em fight their own fight.

booya.

Wow, where to begin. Basically, I'll throw it in with etcetera, neuboy, roadie, stopforme, et al. At first I was wondering why GSTP would even continue with a story that begins "Now, I dont consider myself racist, Some of the things I say, may though, and I apologize", but I expected to read about something not that offensive that could be easily misconstrued. Instead, the story took every opportunity to stereotype and offend possible. I'm not going to rehash the argument, but the same story could easily have been told without relying on tired, RACIST images that stay with us from slavery days. Saying a character in a story is black and another is white is one thing. Making them into caricatures based on their race is a completely different thing, and one that I wish we had left in our past.

I'm a little confused about why y'all are schocked that we're calling it racist when GTSP admitted it from the outset.

As for RD, foldsfan, and anyone else who claims that racism does not exist in America or that it's a situation made up to start a fight: Your comments are possibly more offensive than the original story. There is no way that you have never witnessed the abuse of a person based on race. Whites may not be beating blacks in the streets (as much), but racism is a daily occurence in all of our lives. You can choose to ignore it, or write it off as people being "sensitive" or "PC", but it is widespread and it is systematic. Do you think it's just bad luck or because of bad genes that such a hugely disproportionate number of African Americans live in poverty or live in jail? Or could it be that our racist history lives on, in the form of marginalizing minorities through educational and job discrimination?

Please note that I don't think any of this discussion makes any of us a racist. I think it does show that some of us are ignorant and choose to remain so. And that's sad.

P.S. For anyone keeping track, it's "U lterior" motives.
P.P.S Anyone who steals money from cancer patients is a dick.

I don't think I ever said my concerns about the money being stolen. I got into this because nobody would leave GSTP alone. Get it straight.

ohhh my god it is so hard to hold back. so i wont.

in reference to your first sentence/paragraph, i do not know if you are a homosexual or not, i do think that you suck and so ill call you a fag
(and you should have used you're instead of your, but i prefer youre because i dont like apostrophes).

im sick of this "colorful language" argument. it obviously does not hold up unless you are referring to how much you address "color" in your story. and i have been informed that the "thugs" that sit under that tree at mtsu could only be generalized as african americans and do not all display the "thuggish" nature that you argue, whether they laughed or not. they were not all criminals, "brutal," or "gangsters."

also, ceeze. i appreciate your imput, always. however, i was not being hypocritical. just as carl pointed out, every homosexual that i have known uses degrading homosexual names to each other and to heterosexuals. i am 99% sure that homosexuals would not be offended by my calling gstp a fag and i am 99% sure that the african americans under the tree at mtsu would be offended by gstps generalization. what i said was only to be offensive to gstp, and if anyone else was affected, i think its possible that they should be considered too sensitive. if your brother has a mental disability and i made an offensive remark about HIM, i would hope that you would take me to task. PLEASE give me shit if its what i deserve.

Ok, I'm still confused as to how I have made caricatures out of anyone here. Yes, you can chop up my story and make analogies, but as a whole unit, my story does nothing but portray the truth. You people are the one's making the "images that stay with us from slavery days" By interpreting words the way you want to make them sound. Go back, re read the story. and think to yourself, are these words really offensive? look them up in the dictionary, notice how they were used in context. Were my intentions to degrade? Because intentions behind a word have a lot to do with it. As said, you can chop my language up, and put motives behind it. But re read, and do it again, and ask yourselves, who is putting the racism behind the words.

This should be spelled input, not imput. oh, i suck too, what else sucks to you?

plenty of things arent meant to be racist. fucking song of the south wasnt intended to be degrading either.

Just because I have to point this out...why do some homosexuals get offended by Eminem when he does the same thing? Some people get offended and some don't. And, it's input, not imput. (sorry)

Well, this topic is getting old for me, because I don't really enjoy arguing about such things when it is obvious that there is no resolution to make everyone happy. With that said, none of us are black, none of us feel the heat of racial persecution, none of us share the same epiphanies to which we have come to our respective conclusions, and we all like to argue. I would like to stop now.

thanks honey

You're welcome. Will you and hoobaincubus be at the show tonight?

Thanks honey

You don't have to be black to feel the heat...I believe stopforme has talked about feeling it before? And I'm pretty sure I feel it when someone else is degraded for their race, even if it's not me being victimized. These conversations do tend to get tedious, so I'll see you in another topic soon.

GSTP- the aspects of your descriptions that are stereotyped have already been pointed out- it's not the words themselves, but how they're used. And, yep, it's true that we all carry racist stereotypes in our head, so our brains all recognize them and fill in the spaces for us, whether we like it or not. I think that sucks, and I think it's evidence of how deeply racist our culture is. Then again Carl could probably give us a good lecture on how stereotyping/ clumping of like info is a neurologic necessity.

I couldnt agree more. I'm simply again standing up for myself. What happens when in fact, the stereotypes are depicted accurately in the reality of life. When a "smiling black man" (which was not even thought of as racial until someone pointed it out) happens to be being a "thug" (thief) whom is "6'5" and atheletically built, whom is stealing money from a small white sorority girl. And other black people whom may or may not be "thugs" are laughing about such an action. While the white kids (whom may or may not be being emo kids) are sitting about 50 feet away.


Does this make me a racist, a bad person?

No, but your feelings on the Irish and Jews does.

okokok, i feel sympathy for those who are persecuted, but we're not being persecuted ourselves. thats what i meant

(Edited by richarddawson at 2:57 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

I did watch alot of Archie Bunker when I was growing up.

What about mexicans, hey and walmart, walmart was busted recently, walmarts in over 20 states had illegal mexican workers. I hate walmart, not mexicans, dammit. What about small business.

(Edited by GrungeSlobTearPants at 3:00 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

hahaha

This would be an excellent change of pace for this conversation. I do not like Wal-Mart. I don't like how they treat the brands that they carry, which I could go into great detail about, but I'll save that typing for later. I do like that Coca-Cola will not always give in and give them discounted prices, since they have the Sam's Choice line. I don't believe that Pepsi does much either, which is refreshing, pardon the pun.

I also don't like how their lower prices drive many customers away from smaller businesses, but I can't contest it because it's not wrong. I just dislike it.

(Edited by richarddawson at 3:12 pm on Oct. 31, 2003)

actually they were mostly eastern europeans. see, listening to NPR pays off!

Also, this effects me some since I will be living in the Bay Area, but super walmarts have been banned in Oakland CA so that small business can thrive. This seems to be a trend, that big business is becomming more and more unpopular.

I guess I stereotyped again, damn psychoneurological spaces being filled, or something......

the puppet show? yes.

I knew we could agree on something aside from reproduction being fun! Wal-Mart is one of the main sources of evil in our society. If you don't believe me, read How Wal-Mart is Destroying America by Bill Quinn, or even a recent Business Week cover story entitled "Is Wal-Mart too Powerful?"

Puppet Show? Where??? If you're serious, that's awesome. I was referring to the DND/Slack show, but puppets would be really fun.

Here's my take on Wal-Mart. It wouldn't exist if people didn't go there. My hometown in Iowa has successfully kept a Wal Mart out now for 15 years. It's a hot topic. The downtown merchants obviously don't want it, but the people do. They just don't understand that it will kill their downtown.

The fact is, is that Wal Mart has sooo much leverage that can get products at a cheaper price than the mom and pop store. People will do what's best for them, they go to Wal Mart and save 10 cents on something.

I'm a total hypocrite because I go to Wal Mart at least twice a week. There's one less than a mile down the street from me. It's to convenient not to. Do I disagree with them and their practices? Hell yes!!! Do I want to pay 75 cents more for windex?!?!? Hell no!!! I figure if Nirvana can cave into to Wal Mart, I can too.

The funny thing is, I've seen studies where Wal Mart is actually no cheaper than any other place. The just give off that perception. They have leader deal where the will actually lose money on a product to get people in and then charge full price or more for other stuff. And the fact that they have higher profit margins because they get their products at a cheaper price they rake in the dough hand over fist.

Ahhh, the tie that binds. Answer...yes Wal-Mart is too powerful.

wal-mart's produce is terrible. it's all genetically over-inflated and gnat infested. nasty little scuzzy store.

I'm pissed because they opened some new stupid Wal-Mart Marketplace (what the hell??) right across the street from Kroger in my neighborhood. What was the point of that?

Also, Supermarkets are bad enough, but huge store/slash supermarkets are even worse (Superwalmarts).

I love visiting the village in England in which my mom (or mum) grew up. It (Woodbridge) has yet to be invaded by Tesco's, so they still actually have a butcher, baker, a green grocer, a florist, and a small market for a little bit o' everything. And the streets are cobblestoned. And they actually have little shops that sell only things like tea cups, and they do a fair amount of business! Fast food consists of take out curry and fish and chips shops. Ah, such fun. I can't wait to go visit next summer.

By the way, I'm curious as to why no one has responded to this.

I think I know who posted this, and I feel sorry for her (I think, "her"). Getting stared at during a whole show because you are a different race from the rest of the crowd or are not wearing cool enough clothes would be awful. I admire this person for having an attitude of understanding, though I'm not sure if I could have the same attitude if I were in the same position.

This whole thread has been a nice reminder for me. I am often guilty of stereotyping my students based on their race, their attire, whether they live in the projects, what kind of music they listen to, etc. Some of these individuals are "hard to manage," skip class often, cuss at me, etc., which leads to my [predominantly racial] stereotypes. Like some have said, it is very, very difficult (perhaps impossible?) to avoid being racist, but I am going to try even harder to wipe it from my system. Thanks, all, for this somewhat ugly disagreement. I think it has probably been beneficial for raising awareness, etc. overall.

Did you know that Wal-Mart is so powerful that they don't even pay for the product you see on the shelves until it sells. This is part of the reason why you can practically return anything to Wal-Mart at any time. They have no monies vested until it crosses the computer scanners at the checkout. Then it is logged as sold and marked as monies owed to said vendor/distributor. They have every vendor/distributor in the world fighting for their floor space.
Distributors/vendors don't have a choice because so many people shop in Wal-Mart every day and they have to keep their numbers. Wal-Mart can have 80 million pounds of "Ol Dick Dog Food" on the floor for a month, and then on a whim, send it back to the distributor. "Nah, fuck you, we changed our minds" How about that for power and control. Never paying a dime in the process.

The town where I lived re-zoned city limits so a Super Wal-Mart could be built. The old Wal-Mart is not sitting vacant, wasting space. My mom told me people went to the grand opening of the new one like they had never seen one before.

the old wal-mart in lebanon was turned into a bud's discount center. they sold wal-mart's overstock, returns, garbage, etc. it may be closed now....i try to avoid lebanon.

This is in a town called Waverly. It's very very small. I don't see why anyone would want to do anything with the building, they would just lose money.



(Edited by MissSeptember at 2:09 pm on Nov. 1, 2003)

Gallatin's old Wal-Mart was split in half to become a Big Lots and a Tractor Supply Company. I miss the old Wal-Mart, for nostalgic purposes only.

I remember the Bud's in Franklin. Scary place, that. Though they had the SpiderMan arcade game out front, and that ruled.

I think all Bud's are gone now. I don't think it worked out for them like Sam's and Wal-Mart have.

Will

Actually, I believe that Bud's was/is owned by Wal-Mart. It was their answer to Big Lots.

Yeah, they were definitely owned by Wal-Mart. But I think they are all gone now because I don't think it was making them money in the same way that Sam's and Wal-Mart do.

Will

i can remember a time when a twenty something lad could walk into a walmart and purchase a wwf championship belt. those days are gone. ray davies and i can both attest to that.

I got into a nyc cab last summer and the cab driver turned to me and said "You aren't a f@%&ing jew are you???!!!"
Well isn't that just nice.

I'm glad I'm not the only one with faulty Jew-dar.

My story isnt in sidelines, looks like it will just end up in the crime log later in the week.

Oh let me tell you-If I had a dollar...
It is really quite flattering I think.

There should be something about it by the end of this week... It should've been in Monday... but... things happen I suppose

well, the story was published today for those still interested. Here is the Link but you may have to be registered to read it. I'll copy and paste the story below. Anyway, I thought my story was much more descriptive.



Charity bandit sought by police

By L.P. Anderson

A former MTSU student swiped donations from a charity fund-raiser held here last week, according to an MTSU police report.

Mondraka Smith, 23, of Murfreesboro, allegedly stole roughly $75 worth of donations from an Up 'Til Dawn carnival held during the afternoon of Oct. 29 near the Keathley University Center, the report stated.

Students had clogged the lawn near the university center at the time Smith approached several members of Alpha Omicron Pi, a sorority that was trading Halloween candy for likely donations, said Jennifer Morgan, philanthropic chair for the sorority.

Sorority members believed it was prank when Smith grasped two jugs of donations from their stall and then sauntered from the carnival, she added during a telephone interview Tuesday.

The girls chased Smith toward the Cyber Cafe while the crowd remaining at the carnival stood dumb, Morgan said.

The thief escaped.

"It seemed like a lot of people at the carnival knew him, but they wouldn't speak up," Morgan said. "Nobody ran after him or anything."

Roughly 13 campus groups at the carnival raised money for Up 'Til Dawn, a fund-raising campaign that aids St. Jude Children's Research Hospital in Memphis.

One student, however, did name Smith as the alleged thief, said MTSU police Lt. Darrell Collins. He would not identify the student.

MTSU police officer Sean Garrison responded to the carnival shortly after the crime, Collins said Tuesday. Garrison filed a warrant for the arrest of Smith, who is charged with robbery.

"He's on the loose out here somewhere," Collins said, "but we haven't caught him yet."

But even if police arrest the thief, Morgan said she doubts the sorority will retrieve its donations. The hospital requested that the sorority raise $2,200 during the fund-raiser that spans several months.

"This was the kick-off to get all the organizations together and start raising money," Morgan said. "Now we have to start from scratch again."

I'll be sure to keep me change jar under lock and key...

Haha, my sister's in that sorority.